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	<title>
	Comments on: The Great Escape	</title>
	<atom:link href="https://www.overlawyered.com/2007/02/the-great-escape/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>https://www.overlawyered.com/2007/02/the-great-escape/</link>
	<description>Chronicling the high cost of our legal system</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 17:54:12 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Ima Fish		</title>
		<link>https://www.overlawyered.com/2007/02/the-great-escape/comment-page-1/#comment-13615</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ima Fish]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 17:54:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://overlawyered.com/wpblog/index.php/2007/02/the-great-escape/#comment-13615</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;em&gt;&quot;I don&#039;t know that it&#039;s a good idea to let police officers run wild.&quot;&lt;/em&gt;

I didn&#039;t make myself clear.  I&#039;m only talking about immunity from civil lawsuits.  I think that police departments can implement guidelines for high-speed chases, and if the officer fails to follow them, he can be disciplined or have his employment terminated.

What I&#039;m against is a third party suing the police for an accident started by a criminal defendant.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>&#8220;I don&#8217;t know that it&#8217;s a good idea to let police officers run wild.&#8221;</em></p>
<p>I didn&#8217;t make myself clear.  I&#8217;m only talking about immunity from civil lawsuits.  I think that police departments can implement guidelines for high-speed chases, and if the officer fails to follow them, he can be disciplined or have his employment terminated.</p>
<p>What I&#8217;m against is a third party suing the police for an accident started by a criminal defendant.</p>
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		<title>
		By: asg		</title>
		<link>https://www.overlawyered.com/2007/02/the-great-escape/comment-page-1/#comment-13614</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[asg]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 17:11:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://overlawyered.com/wpblog/index.php/2007/02/the-great-escape/#comment-13614</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;ASG, the officer is being sued for violating the constitutional rights of the defendant, not for failing to listen to his boss.&lt;/i&gt;

It seems to me these are not mutually exclusive (what, after all, is an illegal search, but a failure to &quot;listen to the boss&quot; and get a proper warrant?).  Additionally, it seems clear from the background that the officer opted for deadly force, when he had received authorization for a lesser level of force.  Again, since we are not (yet) talking about whether Harris should recover damages, but only about whether he should get his day in court, it seems far from clear to me that his case should be dismissed out of hand.
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>ASG, the officer is being sued for violating the constitutional rights of the defendant, not for failing to listen to his boss.</i></p>
<p>It seems to me these are not mutually exclusive (what, after all, is an illegal search, but a failure to &#8220;listen to the boss&#8221; and get a proper warrant?).  Additionally, it seems clear from the background that the officer opted for deadly force, when he had received authorization for a lesser level of force.  Again, since we are not (yet) talking about whether Harris should recover damages, but only about whether he should get his day in court, it seems far from clear to me that his case should be dismissed out of hand.</p>
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		<title>
		By: MF		</title>
		<link>https://www.overlawyered.com/2007/02/the-great-escape/comment-page-1/#comment-13613</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[MF]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 16:28:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://overlawyered.com/wpblog/index.php/2007/02/the-great-escape/#comment-13613</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;the two most likely outcomes are: Losing and getting nothing, or winning and being underpaid for their efforts.&lt;/i&gt;

That doesn&#039;t sound like two losing possibilities for those attornies.  That sounds like two &lt;b&gt;winning&lt;/b&gt; opportunities.  Even if they lose the case and get nothing, the have the recognition / notoriety that comes with having a case heard at the SCOTUS.  Do you think that has no value?  You can bet your bottom dollar (pun intended) that it does, even if they lose.  And if they win, now they are a firm that has WON a case at SCOTUS.  That doesn&#039;t even take into account the possibility that they win at SCOTUS and then also win at the liability lawsuit, which likely reaps bug bucks.  Sorry, I disagree 100% with the &quot;underpaid&quot; view.
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>the two most likely outcomes are: Losing and getting nothing, or winning and being underpaid for their efforts.</i></p>
<p>That doesn&#8217;t sound like two losing possibilities for those attornies.  That sounds like two <b>winning</b> opportunities.  Even if they lose the case and get nothing, the have the recognition / notoriety that comes with having a case heard at the SCOTUS.  Do you think that has no value?  You can bet your bottom dollar (pun intended) that it does, even if they lose.  And if they win, now they are a firm that has WON a case at SCOTUS.  That doesn&#8217;t even take into account the possibility that they win at SCOTUS and then also win at the liability lawsuit, which likely reaps bug bucks.  Sorry, I disagree 100% with the &#8220;underpaid&#8221; view.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Eric @ New York Personal Injury Law Blog		</title>
		<link>https://www.overlawyered.com/2007/02/the-great-escape/comment-page-1/#comment-13612</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Eric @ New York Personal Injury Law Blog]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 15:16:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://overlawyered.com/wpblog/index.php/2007/02/the-great-escape/#comment-13612</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;In any case, the point wasn&#039;t whether this particular trial lawyer, who was faced with an appeal all the way to the Supreme Court, would receive a windfall, but whether trial lawyers in general, faced with such cases, would.&lt;/blockquote&gt;A windfall for anyone is unlikely given the very high levels of comparative negligence. It&#039;s not like defense counsel will roll over and play dead during trial.  In the face of this, plaintiff&#039;s counsel absorbs the risk of tens of thousands of dollars in disbursements that will never be returned with a defense verdict. The risk of such representation is spectacularly high.

]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>In any case, the point wasn&#8217;t whether this particular trial lawyer, who was faced with an appeal all the way to the Supreme Court, would receive a windfall, but whether trial lawyers in general, faced with such cases, would.</p></blockquote>
<p>A windfall for anyone is unlikely given the very high levels of comparative negligence. It&#8217;s not like defense counsel will roll over and play dead during trial.  In the face of this, plaintiff&#8217;s counsel absorbs the risk of tens of thousands of dollars in disbursements that will never be returned with a defense verdict. The risk of such representation is spectacularly high.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Deoxy		</title>
		<link>https://www.overlawyered.com/2007/02/the-great-escape/comment-page-1/#comment-13611</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Deoxy]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 14:48:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://overlawyered.com/wpblog/index.php/2007/02/the-great-escape/#comment-13611</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I would support complete immunity for the police from the criminal in question in any high speed chase situation, as anything lse creates perverse incentives.

I would go even further and make the criminal liable for collateral damage as well, with possible liability for the police if some fairly high standard can be met that showed that the police caused some damage purposefully (basically, a standard designed to prevent abuse such as an officer using th chase an as excuse to run down someon they don&#039;t like or something).

Basically, we want high speed chases to be as rare as possible.  The best way to do this is to make sure that they NEVER EVER EVER pay off for the guy trying to outrun the police.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would support complete immunity for the police from the criminal in question in any high speed chase situation, as anything lse creates perverse incentives.</p>
<p>I would go even further and make the criminal liable for collateral damage as well, with possible liability for the police if some fairly high standard can be met that showed that the police caused some damage purposefully (basically, a standard designed to prevent abuse such as an officer using th chase an as excuse to run down someon they don&#8217;t like or something).</p>
<p>Basically, we want high speed chases to be as rare as possible.  The best way to do this is to make sure that they NEVER EVER EVER pay off for the guy trying to outrun the police.</p>
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		<title>
		By: David Nieporent		</title>
		<link>https://www.overlawyered.com/2007/02/the-great-escape/comment-page-1/#comment-13610</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[David Nieporent]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 08:54:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://overlawyered.com/wpblog/index.php/2007/02/the-great-escape/#comment-13610</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Eric, how much do you think it costs to care for a 20-year old quadriplegic for his entire life?  The damage award could be quite large, no?  (Moreover, this is a 1983 case, not a mere negligence case, so the statute provides for attorneys fees if he prevails.)

In any case, the point wasn&#039;t whether this particular trial lawyer, who was faced with an appeal all the way to the Supreme Court, would receive a windfall, but whether trial lawyers in general, faced with such cases, would.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Eric, how much do you think it costs to care for a 20-year old quadriplegic for his entire life?  The damage award could be quite large, no?  (Moreover, this is a 1983 case, not a mere negligence case, so the statute provides for attorneys fees if he prevails.)</p>
<p>In any case, the point wasn&#8217;t whether this particular trial lawyer, who was faced with an appeal all the way to the Supreme Court, would receive a windfall, but whether trial lawyers in general, faced with such cases, would.</p>
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		<title>
		By: William Nuesslein		</title>
		<link>https://www.overlawyered.com/2007/02/the-great-escape/comment-page-1/#comment-13609</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[William Nuesslein]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 02:29:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://overlawyered.com/wpblog/index.php/2007/02/the-great-escape/#comment-13609</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[There was a case around 1960 of a young man going off the highway and hitting a rock at nearly 100 mph. The police would have been sued except that the young man was not being chased. Those familiar with NY 97 will appreciate the folly of traveling at high speed on that road.

I saw the video in the Supreme Court Case. The bump did not cause the accident, the high speed did. Any minor distraction could be disasterous.

Police running wild make good B movies, but most Police departments have disciplinary procedures to enforce discipline. I doubt if law suits have any positive effect.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There was a case around 1960 of a young man going off the highway and hitting a rock at nearly 100 mph. The police would have been sued except that the young man was not being chased. Those familiar with NY 97 will appreciate the folly of traveling at high speed on that road.</p>
<p>I saw the video in the Supreme Court Case. The bump did not cause the accident, the high speed did. Any minor distraction could be disasterous.</p>
<p>Police running wild make good B movies, but most Police departments have disciplinary procedures to enforce discipline. I doubt if law suits have any positive effect.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Acqua Royale		</title>
		<link>https://www.overlawyered.com/2007/02/the-great-escape/comment-page-1/#comment-13608</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Acqua Royale]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 02:08:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://overlawyered.com/wpblog/index.php/2007/02/the-great-escape/#comment-13608</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Oh, and in response to TheManTheMyth&#039;s comment that &quot;police officers are, shall we say, less than brilliant people,&quot; you should try counsel in my town.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, and in response to TheManTheMyth&#8217;s comment that &#8220;police officers are, shall we say, less than brilliant people,&#8221; you should try counsel in my town.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Acqua Royale		</title>
		<link>https://www.overlawyered.com/2007/02/the-great-escape/comment-page-1/#comment-13607</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Acqua Royale]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 02:04:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://overlawyered.com/wpblog/index.php/2007/02/the-great-escape/#comment-13607</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[This reminds me of British bobbies being forced not to pursue motorcycle or bicycle thieves if said thief is not wearing a helmet.  Pull down the temple.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This reminds me of British bobbies being forced not to pursue motorcycle or bicycle thieves if said thief is not wearing a helmet.  Pull down the temple.</p>
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		<title>
		By: gitarcarver		</title>
		<link>https://www.overlawyered.com/2007/02/the-great-escape/comment-page-1/#comment-13606</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[gitarcarver]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 01:50:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://overlawyered.com/wpblog/index.php/2007/02/the-great-escape/#comment-13606</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;fact that many police officers are, shall we say, less than brilliant people,&lt;/i&gt;

This is a cheap shot.  It is easy for us to sit in the comfort of a cozy ofice or home and secomnd, third or even fouth guess some cop on the streets.  When we come to a different conclusion or course of action than we come to, that must mean they are not bright.

While there are cops that may make questionable decisions or that may not have the IQ of a genius, they also don&#039;t have the benefit of time when making decisions, or the benefit of the ability to appeal something that goes against them.

Every day in this country, some court somewhere reverses a decision of another lower court.  Was the lower court comprised of &quot;less than brillant people?&quot;  Are the lawyers that are said to provide ineffecive counsel less than brillant for their performance as well?

Saying that many cops are less than brillant is a cheap shot.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>fact that many police officers are, shall we say, less than brilliant people,</i></p>
<p>This is a cheap shot.  It is easy for us to sit in the comfort of a cozy ofice or home and secomnd, third or even fouth guess some cop on the streets.  When we come to a different conclusion or course of action than we come to, that must mean they are not bright.</p>
<p>While there are cops that may make questionable decisions or that may not have the IQ of a genius, they also don&#8217;t have the benefit of time when making decisions, or the benefit of the ability to appeal something that goes against them.</p>
<p>Every day in this country, some court somewhere reverses a decision of another lower court.  Was the lower court comprised of &#8220;less than brillant people?&#8221;  Are the lawyers that are said to provide ineffecive counsel less than brillant for their performance as well?</p>
<p>Saying that many cops are less than brillant is a cheap shot.</p>
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